The majority of travelers are ID-compliant — around 94 percent, according to the TSA.
It seems crazy to me that 6% of travelers are going to the airport without ID. (I presume that accompanied minors who aren't required to show ID are included in the 94%)
Real ID is a series of annoying steps that you need to go through to get a star on your license. People that haven't "upgraded" to Real ID are the noncompliant ones.
As a legal immigrant, you get used to dealing with government bureaucracy, and the demands are usually higher than for citizens. Places where you get the same treatment as citizens then don't feel so bad in comparison.
Renewing non-REAL ID driver's license is online.
Getting a REAL ID requires a trip to DMV, and this is why I am avoiding it. Essentially for this reason, i am just choosing to renew my regular ID instead of getting a REALID one.
The good thing is I have many ids that can be used in lieu of REAL ID:
- Passport card
- Passport
- Global entry card
So I will probably never get a REAL ID until California does away with non-REAL ID ids.
Getting a real id requires you to bring in paperwork that doesn't exist for me anymore. They want a utility bill? I do everything paperless. I am unable to get a real id because of their ridiculous "proof" requirements.
It's not about identifying people. I have a passport and can show that to them. I have a global entry card. Both qualify as a substitute for a real id. But I cannot use the global entry card as a form of proof of identity. No, please bring a landline telephone bill to us.
The annoying extra steps involve stuff like authenticating your residence address with additionjal documents. Enough hassle that I didn't bother with mine, as it would have taken extra time and I waited til the last minute before renewing. It's also a privacy invasion. And to do it now I'd have to pay a bunch extra to get a replacement license when I otherwise don't need to. I hope someone can get this new TSA fee blocked by a court.
Added: I think Real ID may also require your license to show your residence address (mine only has my mailing address). California's DMV collects residence addresses but treats them as confidential, ever since actress Rebecca Schaefer got murdered by a stalker who got her address from the DMV. There is a separate space on the application form where you can write the address you want them to print on your license.
Not to mention that the list of acceptable documents has changed multiple times, compliant IDs usually cost extra, issuing clerks often didn't accept digital bills or state documents like voter registration, and some states (e.g. Arizona) only started issuing compliant IDs within the last few years.
It's a rollout practically designed for noncompliance.
As a US citizen I "just" needed to present my birth certificate and Social Security card to the DMV along with my "normal" license, and a print-out of a paystub from my employer online (that they didn't even look at).
Of course, the second factor is "going to the DMV", which depending on area can either be an all-day hellscape, or if you're rural, five minutes in and out.
I did have to get some additional docs and come back to the AAA office, Not really a big deal but you did need one or two additional docs even though I have a passport.
Just FYI: nowadays they only use each security question once, so apparently if they run out of questions after many times of doing this, you might not get cleared to fly.
While I don’t feel one way or another about this w.r.t. charging this fee to people without a Real ID who show up with a normal ID, as someone who has just lost their ID entirely, or shown up accidentally to the airport without it -
This totally makes sense.
The amount of effort it takes for a TSA agent (granted, this is mostly entirely fabricated effort, this seems like a more solved problem, but I digress) to verify my identity the few times this had happened is well worth $18.
It’s not a quick phone call to an external agency and you rattle off your social; it’s a whole shebang.
“Did you live at x? Who else lived at that address with you?”
“What was your sisters last address before her current”
“What was the second address you lived at in [city]”
To be entirely honest, the whole thing was super entertaining. I think part of it was just it made me feel like some super spy.
Anyway - good on them for charging a few bucks. Don’t forget your ID or get your ID updated.
(Sidenote: this line of questioning wasn’t this interesting every time. Sometimes it is more like a one and done question, but I am at my most impressed with TSA when it seems like they actually do give a fuck, and the times it’s been an in-depth line of questioning has stuck with me)
"As an EU national, you have the right to travel freely in the 27 EU member countries as well as in Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland (non-EU countries but members of the Schengen area) carrying either a valid passport or a national identity card (ID card)."
Last time I flew from Spain they only checked at the gate (which I didn't expect).
Also, most of these countries demand that you have an ID with you at all times outside. Yeah I don't do it either, because where I live is full of pickpockets and a new ID card means travelling for hours to the capital and paying 180€. I'm from Holland and they don't support their citizens abroad well. They even closed all the consulates to save money, as if they're a piss poor country :) Even most poor countries have money for consulates. But if you're a business owner they still have a contact in every city. Stupid neoliberals.
Schengen thing should be working like this but more and more I have been asked for ID/passport, usually by the airline before boarding or local police acting as border guards after arrival.
>>In Europe I don't need to show ID for flights inside the Schengen Area
Really?
I fly between Schengen countries multiple times a year. I don't remember one where I wasn't required to show my ID at both check-in and then gates. There are even ID scanners at the gates.
Driving licence doesn't count as ID either. It's either passport or official government ID card.
Once you've privatised government operations, the tax revenue flows directly to the NATIONAL SECURITY contractor, so extra taxes is all good. You're paying enterprising folks for the privilege of walking around in a free country.
Real ID is a series of annoying steps that you need to go through to get a star on your license. People that haven't "upgraded" to Real ID are the noncompliant ones.
I don't remember any annoying steps to get Real ID at the CA DMV in San Francisco. (For reference, I'm not a US citizen, but am here legally.)
What are the annoying steps others have faced?
As a legal immigrant, you get used to dealing with government bureaucracy, and the demands are usually higher than for citizens. Places where you get the same treatment as citizens then don't feel so bad in comparison.
Renewing non-REAL ID driver's license is online. Getting a REAL ID requires a trip to DMV, and this is why I am avoiding it. Essentially for this reason, i am just choosing to renew my regular ID instead of getting a REALID one.
The good thing is I have many ids that can be used in lieu of REAL ID: - Passport card - Passport - Global entry card
So I will probably never get a REAL ID until California does away with non-REAL ID ids.
>Getting a REAL ID requires a trip to DMV
Getting a real id requires you to bring in paperwork that doesn't exist for me anymore. They want a utility bill? I do everything paperless. I am unable to get a real id because of their ridiculous "proof" requirements.
It's not about identifying people. I have a passport and can show that to them. I have a global entry card. Both qualify as a substitute for a real id. But I cannot use the global entry card as a form of proof of identity. No, please bring a landline telephone bill to us.
It's just another humiliation ritual.
A landline lol are they living in the 90s?
> They want a utility bill? I do everything paperless. I
They accept printed pdfs over even a pdf on your phone.
The annoying extra steps involve stuff like authenticating your residence address with additionjal documents. Enough hassle that I didn't bother with mine, as it would have taken extra time and I waited til the last minute before renewing. It's also a privacy invasion. And to do it now I'd have to pay a bunch extra to get a replacement license when I otherwise don't need to. I hope someone can get this new TSA fee blocked by a court.
Added: I think Real ID may also require your license to show your residence address (mine only has my mailing address). California's DMV collects residence addresses but treats them as confidential, ever since actress Rebecca Schaefer got murdered by a stalker who got her address from the DMV. There is a separate space on the application form where you can write the address you want them to print on your license.
Not to mention that the list of acceptable documents has changed multiple times, compliant IDs usually cost extra, issuing clerks often didn't accept digital bills or state documents like voter registration, and some states (e.g. Arizona) only started issuing compliant IDs within the last few years.
It's a rollout practically designed for noncompliance.
Likely documentation-related.
As a US citizen I "just" needed to present my birth certificate and Social Security card to the DMV along with my "normal" license, and a print-out of a paystub from my employer online (that they didn't even look at).
Of course, the second factor is "going to the DMV", which depending on area can either be an all-day hellscape, or if you're rural, five minutes in and out.
Going to the DMV is the annoying step
I did have to get some additional docs and come back to the AAA office, Not really a big deal but you did need one or two additional docs even though I have a passport.
I have done at least 20 flights with no ID. Long story. But yeah this would be clutch for dumbasses like me.
Just FYI: nowadays they only use each security question once, so apparently if they run out of questions after many times of doing this, you might not get cleared to fly.
That’s surprising, would expect that accurint or whatever they use could come up with basically unlimited questions.
We have time.
Why do I have a feeling this is just going to be bolting a bill acceptor onto CLEAR kiosks as the "alternative biometric verification"?
https://archive.ph/EvIyA
While I don’t feel one way or another about this w.r.t. charging this fee to people without a Real ID who show up with a normal ID, as someone who has just lost their ID entirely, or shown up accidentally to the airport without it -
This totally makes sense.
The amount of effort it takes for a TSA agent (granted, this is mostly entirely fabricated effort, this seems like a more solved problem, but I digress) to verify my identity the few times this had happened is well worth $18.
It’s not a quick phone call to an external agency and you rattle off your social; it’s a whole shebang.
“Did you live at x? Who else lived at that address with you?” “What was your sisters last address before her current” “What was the second address you lived at in [city]”
To be entirely honest, the whole thing was super entertaining. I think part of it was just it made me feel like some super spy.
Anyway - good on them for charging a few bucks. Don’t forget your ID or get your ID updated.
(Sidenote: this line of questioning wasn’t this interesting every time. Sometimes it is more like a one and done question, but I am at my most impressed with TSA when it seems like they actually do give a fuck, and the times it’s been an in-depth line of questioning has stuck with me)
Why do they need to identify you for a domestic flight anyway?
In Europe I don't need to show ID for flights inside the Schengen Area. You go through security, they check your luggage and it's done.
There is no legitimate reason for the government to identify you on a domestic flight
Edit: disregard this if you're talking specifically about showing ID at security checkpoints (instead of at boarding).
> In Europe I don't need to show ID for flights inside the Schengen Area.
What countries are you traveling between?
I've flown at least a dozen times between Portugal and Spain or France the past few years and they've checked my ID in both directions each time.
It's also required to at least carry ID (presumably because it may be checked): https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/entry-exit/eu-c...
"As an EU national, you have the right to travel freely in the 27 EU member countries as well as in Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland (non-EU countries but members of the Schengen area) carrying either a valid passport or a national identity card (ID card)."
Last time I flew from Spain they only checked at the gate (which I didn't expect).
Also, most of these countries demand that you have an ID with you at all times outside. Yeah I don't do it either, because where I live is full of pickpockets and a new ID card means travelling for hours to the capital and paying 180€. I'm from Holland and they don't support their citizens abroad well. They even closed all the consulates to save money, as if they're a piss poor country :) Even most poor countries have money for consulates. But if you're a business owner they still have a contact in every city. Stupid neoliberals.
"We need your id to put your name on the passenger manifest"
"The manifest is required by law"
"We can't just put your possibly-fake name on the manifest because then we'd be committing a crime"
Combinations of other rules probably effectively require it, even if nonsensical.
Schengen thing should be working like this but more and more I have been asked for ID/passport, usually by the airline before boarding or local police acting as border guards after arrival.
>>In Europe I don't need to show ID for flights inside the Schengen Area
Really? I fly between Schengen countries multiple times a year. I don't remember one where I wasn't required to show my ID at both check-in and then gates. There are even ID scanners at the gates.
Driving licence doesn't count as ID either. It's either passport or official government ID card.
Maybe they're talking specifically about the security checkpoints, rather than the other 2 places where ID gets checked.
Maybe we're moving checkpoints instead of goalposts.
>This totally makes sense.
But asking people to show ID to vote is racist, right?
There's nothing about the process of obtaining a "real id" that makes sense.
Another tax. Great. From a Republican administration. What the hell?
The REAL ID act was an expensive unfunded mandate passed in 2005, so the republican administration that imposed this tax is actually that of GWB.
God I had forgotten how old this law is. And how consistently it has been delayed for decades. Born of the post 9/11 world and its concerns...
Once you've privatised government operations, the tax revenue flows directly to the NATIONAL SECURITY contractor, so extra taxes is all good. You're paying enterprising folks for the privilege of walking around in a free country.